Nick Gill made an interesting comment on the last post:
Ironically, I wonder if online sermons might offer an opportunity to reshape the assembly of the saints into a more healthy pattern?
If we could get more people to listen to sermons on their iPods, et al, we wouldn’t have to give so much assembly time to sermons — there’d be more time for communion, for public reading of Scripture, for dialogue.
What do you think? Am I dreaming?
The answer is yes, of course, Nick is dreaming. We’ve got a whole industry built around Sunday sermons. What would we do with all of the out-of-work preachers?
OK, seriously, it’s an intriguing idea. Sunday sermons are a relatively recent addition to Christian assemblies. [Edited at noon, August 13: OK, I’ve had to back off this statement. I may write more about this in a future post. I believe that sermons in their present form didn’t exist in the first century, but my original statement was misleading] They’ve come to dominate the time that God’s people spend together. What if we could remove that teaching experience to another time of the week?
I enjoyed yesterday’s poll. Let’s do another one:
Photo by Ian Britton, FreeFoto.com
Why is this a “new idea?” Many congregations have had “singing nights” or “song and prayer nights” on certain Sunday evenings for years. True there is usually a short devotional thought and most likely an opportunity for people to respond for prayers / conversion, but there is not a “sermon.”
Many of us have also participated in Sunday AM worship when the entire time was about the Lord’s Supper. Time was spent talking about the importance of the sacrifice and the meaning of the elements. Each element was described before the congregation joined in fellowship in each and each had a song or two song before it. The rest of the “hour” was spent in prayer and song.
Just my ramblings . . .
We’re discussing the role of the sermon in our congregation now since we’re transitioning preaching duties and such. One observation that was made by one of our teaching ministers was, “The only request I’ve ever had regarding the sermon is to make is shorter.” I’ve surveyed ~1000 new members at congregations over the last several years about the current reasons they chose this congregation and about what they consider the highlight of congregations they’ve been a part of in the past. Top two are singing/worship and fellowship. Sermons have been mentioned by fewer than 10 of that 1000.
We’re also taking into consideration that speaking is the least effective form of teaching/communication possible and misses a good portion of the congregation who may be more visual or kinesthetic learners. Add into that fact that the concept of discipleship being information driven is an outdated and bankrupt philosophy, and you start to paint a pretty poor picture for the role of preaching in the life of the congregation.
We’re not sure what we’ll do with it yet, but the focus will probably be shorter sermons that are strategically designed to engage multiple learning styles. We’ll also occasionally skip the sermon in favor of another teaching activity, which we did with a introductory VBS drama a few weeks ago.
And Tim, get WP-Polls so we don’t have to leave your site to respond and see results.
My biggest concerns with the way we do things now re: sermon are threefold:
1) Public reading of Scripture — Paul tells Timothy to “devote [him]self to the public reading of Scripture.” DEVOTE, Paul says. We’ve clipped that down to a few verses right before the sermon, and we soothe our consciences by saying that the preacher is opening Scripture to us, so it must be the same thing. It isn’t the same thing. God gave us SCRIPTURE to shape our lives, and with as little Scripture as I believe is being read in most Christian homes, we need more of it being read in the assembly, where our communal identity can be formed by God’s Word.
2) Communion – The focus of the early church seems to have been on communion. Do you ever hear them say, “When we gathered together to hear the sermon…”? of course not. It is, “When we gathered to break bread.” We feel like we must rush communion (as well as the other aspects of communal worship) in order to get the preacher as much time as we can before the traditional dismissal time.
3) Preaching to the choir – we’ve taken Acts 20 as the authoritative pattern for early church gatherings, when Luke makes it pretty clear that this was a unique circumstance that shaped this particular assembly. And Luke himself says that Paul went on and on and on. A narrative written to compare Paul (and Peter, in the plot of Acts) with Jesus got reduced to a formula for Sunday AM perfectionism. How often in the NT is preaching directed at Christians?
That should be enough for today. And I don’t mean to remove sermons from the lives of the saints — I *love* sermons, and I listen to them more than any normal person should. I just don’t think the Sunday AM gathering is the best time to hear them every single week.
Great thoughts, guys. I’m a little overwhelmed with other projects, but I am reading the comments.
And Brad, that’s a good suggestion. I looked quickly at plug-ins for doing polls, but decided to go a different route simply because I wasn’t familiar with the plug-ins.
Grace and peace,
Tim Archer
LOL I wish there was a way to export FB comments back to your blog.
Nick,
There will be soon… with Google Wave.
Acts: 20:7: And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.
count your blessings. :)
The 30 years I preached, I did not object to replacing the sermon time with something more beneficial, particularly time for specific ministry to people in the assembly that really needed to be cared for or just time in prayer or worship and, especially, to make communion more meaningful and intentional. I was not as accommodating to have a guest speaker, though. Be that as it may, we have so conditioned our people to hearing a sermon, I always received complaints when the sermon was replaced with worship.
I agree with Brad’s comments because otherwise he has the power to do something nasty to my blog … something that I would be unable to fix! There is still something to be said, though, about the power of a living Word and the possibilities of what can be done through this ancient form of communication known as speaking! I just think we could do a far better job of communicating the Word through ministry rather than one person talking to everyone else.
Though I am no longer preaching, I must say I thoroughly enjoy the very thought-provoking sermons I hear from our preacher each week. His lessons lead me deeper into both the written Word and the Living Word, Jesus.
I wonder what the alternatives are to sermon-less and sermon-dominated services.
I had a brother a few weeks ago tell me, “I don’t like to take too much time with the Lord’s Supper; I want to leave time for what’s most important.” He saw the look on my face and added, “Well, you know, what people think is most important.”
That’s the biggest problem I see.
Grace and peace,
Tim Archer
Anthony, I thought we were only supposed to do pendulum swings. You mean we can seek middle ground?
7 Lamond said:
Acts: 20:7: And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.
Clay’s response:
I’m thinking this misunderstanding of what actually occured can be cleared up when one determines the meaning of the word “preached”until midnight, in the Greek.
I’m thinking the Greek word for preach found in Acts 20:7 is the root word we get our English word Dialogue from.
What about it Greek scholars, where art thou?
Grace and peace Clay McCool
The Catholics get it right wrt reading Scripture in assemblies. The whole Bible is read aloud in a 3 year cycle.
At my congregation we sometimes replace the sermon with a panel discussion or a question and answer session. We also have services with no sermon from time to time (Praise and Worship evening services, Kid Services once a term etc). We also regularly have drama and film (Nooma particularly) to enhance the message.
btw I voted that I think sermon-less assemblies are a great idea – but not as a norm. I think it’s good to mix the format of our meetings – for various reasons.
Thanks everyone. Great discussion. We’ll continue with this topic tomorrow. (Whatever happened to books and blogs on Friday?)
McCool, you are absolutely right about the word (translated, preach) but drop down a few words to, (and continued his speech until midnight) the word logos is translated (speech) now lets look at the definition of the word sermon.
sermon
–noun
1. a discourse for the purpose of religious instruction or exhortation, esp. one based on a text of Scripture and delivered by a member of the clergy as part of a religious service.
2. any serious speech, discourse, or exhortation, esp. on a moral issue.
3. a long, tedious speech.
(and continued his speech until midnight)
“Until I come, devote yourself to the public reading of Scripture, to preaching and to teaching.”
– The Apostle Paul to Timothy, 1 Timothy4.13, TNIV
I don’t know what this looked like for the assemblies in Ephesus. I assume Timothy was in the minority, that he was literate and therefore gifted to do what most Christians of his time were not..,read and read publically, therefore as one called by God into ministry he was also gifted for “preaching” and “teaching” in the assembly. Perhaps because of the illiteracy of many and the lack of the modern printing press is the reason for emphasizing the reading of scripture.
Many Christians today assume preaching and teaching are merely just two sides of the same coin…possibly but possibly not. What we do know is that scripture has the power to challenge believers in the way of righteousness (cf. 2 Timothy 3.16). It seems to be a safe assumption that this function involved preaching and teaching.
I don’t believe the form of preaching and teaching should be a fixed, unchangeable means. I do believe the function of preaching and teaching is indisposable. We need to think of creative ways to Christian communication (which is what preaching and teaching are). I try to use technology (You-Tube, Movie Clips, etc…) to my advantage. Yet we must be weary of the consumer approach regarding the what and how of the assembly (this has gone on for far too long). However, as important as the question of style and method to communication is, the more pressing question is the question of content. What are we preaching and teaching? In the larger Christian church, there seems to have been a trend of less gospel and more therapeutic help. I have seen some CoC’s following this trend. What we need is theologians (in the best sense) who call the church into the gospel, into the world scripture envisions…inspiring, invigorating, and challenging the church to live out the gospel with reckless abandonment and if this can be accomplished through creative and non-conventional means then I am all for it. But if the creative and non-conventional means are just another way to pacify a consumer driven culture, I want nothing of it.
Grace and peace,
Rex
Rex, I very much agree with the last part of what you wrote. We need people to preach God’s Word. One friend of mine recently took a preaching job where they had a covenant between the elders and the minister that was read by both on his first Sunday. Part of it said something like, “I commit myself to preach the truth as I see it in God’s Word, no matter the personal cost.” That’s what we need… people committed to preaching the truth, preaching the truth in love, but preaching the truth.
Grace and peace,
Tim Archer
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